What is the performance gap between first-class domestic cars and Japanese cars such as Great Wall Motor and Guangzhou Automobile Chuanqi?

If the performance of the autonomous department is worse than that of the American department and German department, there is still a long way to go, but if it is compared with Japanese family cars, it is actually the gap in the stability of the cars.

The gap of parts technology is not only the gap of brands, but also the gap of parts precision, assembly precision and material ratio between the two countries.

When Mr. Qian returned to China in his early years, it was nothing more than a failure to engage in airplanes and rockets. But at some point, the big XX and XX of nodes once again hurt the industrial development. This foundation is not made of money. We have top designers in China, whether it is engine front-end design or body structure design.

But? How is the production progress? What is the best process ratio and the best ingredient ratio for each process? Therefore, engineering will not be taught to us by foreigners. We should use the accumulation of several generations to explore for ourselves. This is the inside story.

For a simple example, the engine cylinder block needs metal casting, but how to eliminate residual stress, how to exhaust gas and how to demould and spray during this casting process? We don't know the optimal proportion of these processes, so the defect rate is naturally much higher than that of joint venture engines.

The other is casting material. We still need to import high-quality cast aluminum and cast iron materials. We have no choice but to master the formula. Although the research and development of high-quality cast aluminum materials has been carried out in China, it is still only used in aerospace and has not been used in automobile manufacturing.

Go out and get the materials. Do we have any questions? Is the accuracy of the machine tool. Machine tools can be bought, lathe workers can't buy them, and CNC program logic can't buy them. If you have a science student, you should know the dimensional accuracy, coaxiality and surface accuracy. A tiny difference is a thousand miles away.

The environmental gap of manufacturing industry is the environmental gap after removing its own technology. Parts manufacturing in China is a process from scratch. Have you ever bought this craft? Only independent research and development.

Then the problem is coming. Speaking of independent research and development, how to develop it? Is the process from the reverse to the positive. However, in today's domestic parts manufacturing industry, you can hardly find one or two enterprises that can resist the banner, all of which are similar to the separatist pattern of "princes' separatist regime is reasonable".

In this environment, enterprises lack independent R&D ability, capital and even spirit-what can businessmen say about patriotism if they can't see the benefits? You can't talk about patriotism until you are full. The current situation is that the parts manufacturing industry is still in the stage of how to eat enough.

Let's go back to the heart of the problem. Neither the Great Wall nor Chuanqi can break through the restrictions of the system. If they reach a certain level in parts accuracy and process flow, it is difficult to make a breakthrough in technology, reliability and durability. This is the biggest gap between independent brands and Japanese and German cars.

Above, thanks for reading, welcome to pay attention.

Great Wall Motor and GAC Chuanqi, first-class domestic cars, are somewhat exaggerated. Of course, this is the difference that everyone understands. You can't deny your opinion, but let's look at the actual situation.

First of all, as a practitioner in the automobile industry, I don't recognize that Great Wall and Chuanqi can represent the ultimate height of their own brands. Secondly, all Japanese cars can talk about performance. Great Wall Motor's proud Haval series and Chuanqi's main model GS4 are all guests on the quality complaint list.

Because of the large sales volume of Haval series, a certain proportion of complaints are acceptable, but the technology platform is reverse to Japan, and there has been no independent research and development for many years. It is also true that hundreds of patterns have been derived from the same platform. This enterprise is the best assembly plant, but an enterprise without core technology and R&D capability is by no means a first-class enterprise.

But it is undeniable that the power platform has been upgraded. Take the 1.5T high-power engine as an example, with the maximum power of 124kw and the peak torque of 285 Nm, which is also leading in the same level of power. Harvard has gone through the stage of learning from foreigners to strengthen itself, and now it can learn from foreigners to control foreigners. As long as it is an independent brand, as long as it can grow and develop in any way, it is worthy of recognition, but there is still a long way to go.

Guangzhou Automobile Chuanqi Technology has been delivered by its own brands and several Guangzhou Automobile joint ventures, and it is superior to Great Wall in R&D capability. Britain's most famous Atkinson cycle engine has also been successfully developed and mass-produced, which is worthy of recognition.

R&D performance is better than Great Wall, but there are still many problems in the final product. Take GS4 as an example, using dry DCT made by Fiat technology Iveco, the failure rate is amazing, and the quality control level is not first-class.

Therefore, these two companies are not qualified to travel independently in the short term, and can vertically integrate R&D and production of all auto parts, covering all fields. At present, only BYD is qualified to represent the national automobile industry. The engine gearbox, electronic configuration and three electric systems are all independently developed and produced, and the models cover passenger cars, commercial vehicles and special vehicles, ranking first in the world and reflecting their strength.

Although BYD also has modern reverse technology, it is something that every car company must experience in the development process. Your so-called Japanese car also started with technical transportation and reverse research and development.

As for the performance of Japanese cars, there is no need to mention the performance below 300 thousand, and only SUV and ORV are seen above 300 thousand. The performance of these models is directly proportional to the price, and it will only be better for any independent first-line brand to launch this level of products. It's just that the development steps are inconsistent At present, independent brands have not launched high-end efforts.

The superstition of joint venture cars is still spreading today in the 2 1 century, which is unhealthy. We don't need colored glasses to look at our own brand cars. The only way to give answers is to touch and find them ourselves. It's not what it used to be.

If you need help, please pay attention to: Tianhe Automobile, which is recommended to be updated every day. This problem is still very challenging, because it is not very simple to say whether the quality of this kind of domestic brand cars and Japanese cars is good or not. For consumers, buying a stable, reliable and durable car is a good car, but for the industry, this is a big problem. I will briefly talk about my own views, and welcome to vomit.

Great Wall Motor or Guangzhou Automobile, the current automobile technology as a whole can be said to have its own engine, but the gearbox is basically absent, and the chassis is not bad. Although there are engines, they all have high fuel consumption. The gearbox is good. AT uses Hyundai or Aisin, and DCT uses Gedrac.

In addition to this hardware deficiency, it takes time to catch up. The improvement of vehicle assembly technology is still obvious, such as Great Wall, Geely, Changan and Chery. Their vehicle sales have passed the million mark, and Changan Geely now sells more than one million vehicles every year, which is very helpful for improving assembly technology. This soft power improvement is still very fast.

However, in terms of vehicle performance, the gap between domestic cars and Japanese cars can be said to be the distance between German, American and Korean. There is still a lack of core technology, and large domestic automobile factories still work for Japanese and German departments to survive, while in many other manufacturing industries, we all have relatively core technology.

So the automobile industry still needs to work hard. Now the overall quality of domestic cars, according to Chery Laoyi, is that we have reached the level of Korean cars. I hope so.

what do you think? Welcome to pay attention to baile fish and communicate together.

Regardless of performance.

Let's start with the conclusion that self-driving cars are just cars that meet family needs. The configuration is in place, and there is still a certain technical reserve from the performance car.

For example, can the price of off-road make Suzuki Jimny convinced?

Limited by the brand, Suzuki Vitera has not lost its full-time four-wheel drive.

To tell the truth, even some domestic cars can't compare with the turning radius of H6.

How do you spell performance?

Who calibrated your GAC Chuanqi gearbox?

I know some people may say BYD, is it interesting for you to take this electric car PK fuel car? Toyota hybrid racing car has not seen anyone say, come to our new Taipei circuit PK.

On the SUV, 600 HP Toyota CHR racing car. Nismo Toure, do you want to challenge? Has anyone set up a high-performance department for domestic cars?

Domestic only means that the family is enough. Configuration meets people's daily needs.

They are all coupe SUVs, and the gearbox response speed of Mazda CX-4 is stronger.

In terms of performance, manufacturers must first have scientific and technological reserves. The appearance has been copied for a long time, and even some domestic cars have a high degree of imitation. What do you think of this spell? It's a carpet attack by the water army. This is 20 18, and some car companies take high imitation as their own responsibility. The Beijing Auto Show and the original are next door. I really admire you.

First of all, I am very grateful to Wukong for providing us with a platform to help each other and answer questions.

How big is the gap? This question is very deep. The surface gap may not be very big, but the deep gap is very big.

Let's talk about the surface gap first:

The surface gap refers to the appearance of the car, the material of the car, the chassis of the car, and the engine power of the car ... these are all categories with relatively low barriers to entry in the automobile industry. To put it bluntly, as long as you study and spend some time, you can make it. Even if you don't get 90 points in the exam, you can cope with it more than enough. These things, after the development of China automobile industry in recent years, are still passable. But the problem is not as simple as you think. The deep gap is that you don't know how many streets others have walked.

Get to the point, the deep gap:

There are two standards to measure the overall industrial level of a country and a famous nation, one is the aerospace industry and the other is the automobile industry. The aerospace industry is devoting all its strength to the whole country. That doesn't explain the problem. The key is the automobile industry. This is a grounded livelihood industry, which truly reflects your industrial level. Because the automobile industry contains almost all kinds of industrial system molecules, such as steel, rubber, electronics and machining industries ... Only when various industrial sub-projects reach a certain level can a good car be manufactured.

Like steel. China's steel output ranks first in the world, but special steel is still imported, which means quantity is not quality. Let's talk about the electronics industry. Nowadays, cars are filled with a large number of electronic and electrical components, especially control units, which are usually called computer boards. At present, there are only three companies in the world that can produce high-quality computer boards, such as the United States, Japan and Germany, while chips, capacitors, field effect transistors and other electrical components are almost monopolized by the United States and Japan. The sensors on the car are either Bosch, Delphi, NTK or the United States, Germany and Japan.

It is easy to make superficial articles. You can design a car with the same beautiful appearance, but the internality can't reach the international advanced level. What's the use of making such a car? Well, in order to meet the performance of the car, you made the shell and interior yourself, but your computer board and chip are made in other countries. If one day the two countries get into trouble and cut off your spare parts supply directly, how can you live?

Therefore, we should not be blindly confused by the appearance that China is now the second largest automobile producer in the world. In fact, the road under our feet is still far away.

The gap between drinking Maotai and driving a racing car

Where are the domestic cars? When driving a new car, everyone is the same! For example, China h530 and Sylphy! I've been driving these two cars! Until they are 80,000 kilometers! China is not wrong! Changed shock absorbers and taillights! Xuanyi didn't move! That doesn't mean anything! Durability is 4 years, it is normal to change things! But driving in China feels that the engine sound is getting louder and louder! It's a little wobbly! I didn't find out why I repaired it! Then the door panel vibrates! The roof is shaking! What about sirfi? The engine is a little loud! There's an abnormal noise! The feeling is that Sylphy is better than China! I can only say that I don't like opening China more and more! As for the reason, I don't know! Anyway, it's just not as easy to drive as Sylphy

Judging from the service of 4s stores, it is still decades behind Japan.

Personal experience, I have Japanese cars and the Great Wall. When domestic cars encounter problems, they go back and say that the design is like this. If the Japanese car cannot be solved on the spot, the manufacturer will pay a return visit within one week.